We Are Power Podcast
The We Are PoWEr podcast spotlights voices and perspectives that need to be heard. Our weekly podcast, with listeners in over 60 countries, delivers PoWErful conversations that inspire, challenge, and empower... from personal life stories to business insights and leadership lessons.
We share diverse experiences, bold discussions, and real solutions. Whether you're looking for career advice, topical themes, or stories of resilience and success - this is where voices spark change.
We Are Power Podcast
Why Inclusivity Matters More Than Ever in Hiring
The brilliant Liz Kingston and Alexandra Ahmet join the We Are PoWEr Podcast - bringing a conversation about making recruitment more inclusive, removing the fear from interviews, and building confidence for anyone chasing their next opportunity.
As part of BT’s talent team, Liz and Alexandra aren’t just hiring people - they’re rethinking how the process works. From making interviews transparent and prep-friendly to encouraging candidates to always ask questions, they share how curiosity and authenticity can set you apart. They open up about the moments they’re most proud of, the lessons that reshaped their own careers, and why inclusivity is everyone’s responsibility - not just leadership’s.
Balancing ambition with real life, they reveal how they juggle work, family, and even the fast-changing world of AI recruitment, all while staying true to themselves. Their message is simple: don’t dim your ambition, and remember there’s more than one way to get where you want to go.
In this episode:
Why asking questions is the most underrated career skill
How BT is making recruitment less intimidating and more transparent
Personal lessons on authenticity, ambition, and self-belief
Why inclusivity is everyone’s job – not just leadership’s
The role of AI in recruitment and what it means for future talent
Superpowers: juggling & compartmentalisation
Trusting your gut and taking different routes to success
Find out more about We Are PoWEr here. 💫
Hello, hello and welcome to the we Are Power podcast. If this is your first time here, the we Are Power podcast is the podcast for you, your career and your life. We release an episode every single Monday with listeners in over 60 countries worldwide, where you'll hear personal life stories, top-notch industry advice and key leadership insight from amazing role models. As we Are Power is the umbrella brand to Northern Power Women Awards, which celebrates hundreds of female role models and advocates every year. This is where you can hear stories from all of our awards alumni and stay up to date with everything MPW Awards and we Are Power. Well, hello and welcome to the podcast. This week, I am delighted to be joined by the BT Group A massive. We have a two for one special Liz and Alex on the couch. Now how is it even possible with you two to describe each other in three words sentence.
Speaker 3:Do you want to go first? I can Go on. I can. Tenacious, inventive and humorous. Oh, I take that.
Speaker 1:Oh, I'm waiting for some jokes to be cracking on through this, Alex.
Speaker 3:Oh, I'm under pressure now what would I say for you? Oh, and stylish. I'm going to sneak a fourth word in. We could hyphenate it right yeah, tenaciously, stylishly, funny there you go.
Speaker 2:That sounds good. I'd go ambitious, direct, straight straightforward, which I like. Yeah, I'd say you're humorous. Direct straightforward, which I like.
Speaker 1:I'd say you're humorous as well, and what are your day jobs? What do you do?
Speaker 2:So we both work in recruitment for BT. So we manage teams and stuff to bring in. Hopefully, good talent is what we want to do. That's our job.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and you're doing things in a new way now, aren't you at BT?
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, we are. I mean, I've been around the block a few more times than Alex. So I've been in recruitment since the late 90s and part of my role when I joined BT, like a year and a half ago or so, was to sort of look at how we recruited and look at how we could make the process more inclusive but also, like, more enjoyable. You know, you, you go to, you go to events or you're asked to, you're asked to coach people or you know as soon, as soon as well. We we normally say we're in talent acquisition and then people go what does? Does that mean? We say recruitment and they're like, oh right, okay, but when you start talking to people about their interview experiences or writing a CV, all of a sudden they're like, oh, I had a terrible experience. Interviews have been the worst part of my life. Oh, I hate writing my own CV.
Speaker 3:So a lot of what I was brought in to do was reimagine how we recruit at BT, make it more inclusive, make it enjoyable and make it into a process where people can showcase what they can do rather than wait to almost fail. So that's something that we sort of designed together as a team and we rolled out. We did a pilot last year and it's it's been phenomenal in terms of feedback, in terms of experience, in terms of what we've got out of it. I think, as a recruitment team, we enjoy our jobs a lot more and we've made really seismic change in terms of inclusion, in terms of gender, in terms of disability and ethnicity and all of those great things, because people enjoy it and they can showcase their skills, not just what they do now, but what they can do in the future. So we are doing things differently.
Speaker 1:And did some of that reimagining coming from your own experience as well of those things that you're just saying they were the horrible things, Do you?
Speaker 2:know what it is. I've worked at BT for nearly 10 years and it's been a really tough challenge to try and change anything process-wise when it comes to the recruitment piece. People want to do it their own way. People have been there a while and I think trying to change that idea of what is a good recruitment process was something that was quite, you know, interesting. People wanted to understand, like, why do we have to change it like this? And you think about all the different things you want to include and, as I said, make candidates more aware of what the process would be. They're not waiting to slip up. They know how, what to expect from us. They can see what the process might be like.
Speaker 3:I think that's what's changed massively for that and actually it's an experience, yeah, and we want it to feel like an experience rather than a waterfall gateway process, so I want them to come away and go.
Speaker 2:Do you know what? I might not have got the role, but the process I had, or the experience I had with the, with that recruitment team, has been really good, so it still would apply again in the future. Or I'd also think, do you know what? I won't change my phone from them now, because actually they work quite good so it's a little bit of that.
Speaker 1:Yeah as well and has there been sort of a good example that you know you've created this new process and you've gone? Oh my gosh, we would never have found that person or the way that person presented this. Yeah that's.
Speaker 2:That's exactly what we wanted? Yeah, 100%. There's been situations where a manager would be very convinced they know who's going to get the job. They've got preconceived ideas. Someone's always going to get it, it's going to be great. And they go through the process and you know, do you know what? If you hadn't have done this, I never would have considered this other person. I'm really struggling to make a decision because you've set it up in such a way that they all have done really well and it was completely unexpected and that's what you want.
Speaker 1:What advice would you give to people watching or listening out there whether it's directly or it's their, their family that are maybe just got results or due to get results or something and it's they've then got to go down this process, but that it's not who. They are maybe a bit introverted or just don't think they've got the stories to tell. What's your one top tip you would give?
Speaker 2:I think ask questions. If you're going through a process, don't be afraid to ask whoever it is that you're going through a process with. Can you tell me more? And it's being that, like you know whatever you're unsure about or you don't understand, like don't just think, because they've told you it's this, you have no choice but to question anything or get any more details that you feel more comfortable about what to expect. I think it's that.
Speaker 3:I think people need to be curious around the process.
Speaker 3:I think they need to look at the tools that are there to succeed. So when you think about, you know we're part of a global recruitment team behind the website and behind the job you're applying for will be somebody in the recruitment team that will want to help you and will be able to you know give you top tips about who it is that you're going to. There are lots of opportunities for you to delve deeper, not only about the company that you are looking to join, but also the people that you're going to meet as part of that process, and whether it's looking at how to succeed on a YouTube channel or using LinkedIn to look at people's profiles and really create those human connections. People like talking about themselves. So, going into an interview if you know who you're going to meet and go oh, I had to look at you on LinkedIn. This is really interesting.
Speaker 3:What did you enjoy about that? It immediately moves it away from that sort of transactional into that human interaction, and straight away you'll feel a lot more relaxed and you'll be then be able to be more yourself, and people still buy people 100%. That's got to be the best bit of the job, right? Yeah, telling somebody they've got a job is without doubt the best part of being in recruitment.
Speaker 2:When you do, they have got some good news for you. It's that bit. It's great because it's life changing.
Speaker 3:You know, you sort of think of all of those pivotal moments where you've made a shift in your career and you know, I, I've, I've got so many examples of so many different people at different points in their career. Um, and it is, it's humbling and heartwarming, it's lovely, it's really nice. Alex, you talked about ask questions.
Speaker 1:What are the best?
Speaker 2:the best question you've ever been asked oh, I'm trying to think, um, but a lot of them will ask me things like so what they like, like who I mean, what are they like? Have you got any tips for me, like what kind of thing should I ask them? And they really want sometimes, like ask a bit more behind the scenes type questions, and those are kind of things that you think you know what they really want to work for us. Well, they're really curious about this and that's a kind of like a tick anyway, because you can see that someone is keen. Um, so those kind of questions are quite good, I think. Yeah, they want to know the inside scoop and sometimes we're not good at telling our own story.
Speaker 1:You've been involved in, yeah, the northern power and awards and we are power community now and uh, and being part of that, judging and reading and assessing those 1,600 nominations coming in. It's a tough thing sometimes to high five yourself and tell your whole story, isn't it? How is it okay to? It's not a humble brag, is it? You've got to go full on brag, haven't you? Or full on answer a question.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and I think we're all quite self-depreciating, aren't we?
Speaker 3:I think as Brits we're quite self-depreciating.
Speaker 3:I think as women we're even more self-depreciating and we're taught from quite young to, you know, find humility but sort of quiet yourself down a little bit.
Speaker 3:You know it's the sort of you have, an assertive man and a bossy woman, you know, and I think sometimes and I say this to people and I've sort of taken my own advice as well when you sort of sat there and you, you know, you're trying to think about what would somebody find interesting in me, and you, you know, you've maybe had a bit of a bad day and you know, whatever, go and ask your support network. You know, your friends, your family. It's a really nice exercise actually, because you think, oh, people do see in me, maybe what I see glimmers of myself. But doing that is a really great mindset shift and it gives a sort of outside in perspective from other people to sort of give yourself a bit of a pat on the back but actually give yourself something meaningful to write in those nominations, because it's hard to sit down with a blank piece of paper. It's really difficult whether it's a CV or a nomination.
Speaker 1:It's a similar process, isn't?
Speaker 3:it in some respects, yeah.
Speaker 1:Because you're winning, going to win an award or to profile yourselves or the same, even if you're only going to the job for experience or to build up sort of that self-belief.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's really tough, though, saying anything about yourself. I mean, that's the hardest part of any of it doing interviews, doing for this it's. It's tough because you can't think of all the good stuff you have to have. Sometimes you need someone to tell you do you know what you're actually really good at?
Speaker 3:this, yeah, this is what you should do. Yeah, and that's always really important it's nice and what about the prep?
Speaker 1:so you've changed the process, but still about the preparation, though, as well, isn't it? And you said curiosity, which I think is one of my favorite words.
Speaker 3:Maybe it's just nosiness me for me, but yeah, yeah yeah, yeah, I mean there's a lot, I think you know, for any business that you're going into, but especially, you know, at BT and and we have values that are sort of waving through life in the business and and um, what we've taken a lot of time to do is bring consistency into the process and be super clear, not just with the managers that you're meeting as part of that experience. We're telling you the topics that you're going to be talking about in each of those three what we're now calling discovery sessions, because we want to move away from this sort of cognizant thing about interviews being sell me this pen, good cop, bad cop. Panellists. You know when you sort of sat there going, oh who do I talk to? And I'm really struggling. We want it to be inclusive and we want to put you into a position where we're telling you the topics.
Speaker 3:It's fine to bring in notes, it's fine to prepare ahead of time. If you basically want to write the question down, reflect on the question and then answer the question, absolutely fine. Set yourself up to succeed and we want to give people the permission to do that. It isn't just about here's a question, and what will set you in good stead is as quickly as you can answer it yeah, we're not assessing good interview people.
Speaker 2:You're not good people that can interview. I'm actually looking about you.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's not a speed test and it's a bit like you know when you go doing your GCSEs and it's like most of the people that fall down in an interview asked a question that answered a question that isn't the question you asked them because you're rushing.
Speaker 2:And that's what it is, isn't it? You panic? Yeah, in those kind of scenarios and the whole point of the process is to try and make it as relaxing as an interview can be. And it's real life, yeah.
Speaker 1:If this is a first job, you've maybe not got that experience. And so all of a sudden, you know I love the whole idea. Take your notes in, take a bit of time. That's what the world of work is going to be. You're not put on the spot on day one.
Speaker 3:Absolutely, absolutely is going to be. You're not putting the spot on day one, absolutely, absolutely. And a really great interview question that I've used in the past for, um, you know people that are maybe coming out of education or pivoting in their career is tell us something that you're proud of because you're an expert in that. Yeah, so it immediately makes people feel confident, it makes them feel an expert on that and it gets them super engaged and it's really interesting for the managers you know and you can have everything from wild camping to filmmaking to fashion styling, but they're an expert in that, so immediately lowers their sort of worry about. You're asking me to talk about something that I'm not hugely confident on Getting it wrong.
Speaker 1:Exactly. None of us want to get it wrong. Exactly. So what are you most proud of?
Speaker 3:Ooh, Personally or professionally, it's back to us. You pick.
Speaker 1:Thank you for the question.
Speaker 3:Answering questions.
Speaker 2:Yeah we always do that.
Speaker 1:Let's try.
Speaker 3:I think professionally, hopefully making making a tangible difference to people's opportunities to grow and fulfill their potential. I would say for me.
Speaker 2:I'm trying to think now. So I think professionally, I think being able to grow myself professionally because I've had three children they're still quite young children and being able to do that and have kids and do big things with our team at BT and stuff like that and still being able to manage the back of my head thinking about other things to do with school and stuff, so I think professionally to be able to do any of that.
Speaker 3:I'm like oh my God.
Speaker 2:Yeah, holding it all together, yeah, basically that's not what I'm most proud of to be able to hold it together and do the family stuff, but still try and push forward with your own career, about what you want to do and you know.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that kind of thing and what advice would you give your you know, not very many years ago selves, because you're both whippersnappers. What advice would you give when it's sometimes because you talk Liz about, you know this could be coming into sort of a new role. It could be straight from academia, it could be that pivot it could be. Sometimes we can be lost, can't we? We're just done in. Yeah, is that me? No, that's probably me. Do you know what? I think we all, we all, we all wake up with a bit of fatigue some days, don't we?
Speaker 3:I think, um, when I started in recruitment uh it was it was quite a male dominated sector. Um, it's not anymore helpfully, but I think in the late 90s when I started, it was very much to succeed, you needed to be a certain way. I think what was helpful at that period of time is it was all about figures and finance, so the most successful person in the room billed the most money. But there were also behaviours that went alongside that and I think it's super easy to look around you and say to succeed, I have to be like that person and I think, looking back in retrospect, I should have been more confident to succeed being my own person than try to replicate maybe some people around me, and I think I don't do that so much anymore because of the confidence that I've sort of that's grown over time, but also probably the environments that I work in now.
Speaker 3:I think we're a lot more open to definitely at BT, open to being your authentic self at work, bringing your entire self to work, talking about life outside work and how that affects self to work, talking about life outside work and how that affects you, know how you show up every day, and I think as a team, we're quite open to that and that's a very different balance to how it used to be and I think if I started my career in that sort of environment, I'd maybe I'd probably be in a different place to where I am now.
Speaker 2:I can see that I think it's the same because I think I grew up in the same situation with recruitment, starting an agency, tech recruitment especially. It is not necessarily a nice place to be back then.
Speaker 3:It's brutal. Really brutal.
Speaker 2:Yeah, as you said, like I think, having the ability to push back and give yourself a bit of space in those kind of not so nice environments and moving to like, yeah, you know, trust what you need, just because you're trying to move forward in your own career and whatever, yeah, it's been. Say like no and that's, that's enough for me, I'm gonna go somewhere else.
Speaker 1:I don't know. Inclusion, equity is, is the heart of, yeah, the, the way we've worked together, isn't it? You know, oh gosh, liz, you and I personally met all those years ago in in Angel Square or up there, I remember.
Speaker 1:And that was all around. You know, sort of coming together as collaborative unit around gender equality. But why is it so important? You know you've talked about how you've changed practices to be more inclusive for individuals, showing up for yourself. But why is it so important, not just to have that International Women's Day or Inclusion Week or Black History Month? Or Mental Health Awareness it's not just for Christmas is it?
Speaker 3:No, it's not, and I think you know, whilst we've come a long way, there is still an awful lot more to do. And Alex mentioned you've got three boys, I've got two girls. I'm sort of coming out of that sort of you know, later teenage years and you're oh, I'm still in the thick of it.
Speaker 2:Still, still, still. Single figures really how young Alex. Seven, five and two Wowzers.
Speaker 3:Yeah, noisy house the three boys as well. Especially the energy levels is insane. Yeah, she comes to work for a restroom. Yeah, basically yeah there. There is still a lot more to do and in some ways it's while it's while. It's great seeing how far we've come in. In you know, my lifetime, I'm making myself sound older than muthusala or whatever.
Speaker 3:But there is still a lot more to, there is still a lot further to go, and I think we can look to society and say, oh, you know, all of this is wrong over here and this needs fixing and yes, it does. But I think you have to sort of think okay, well, what can little old me do in terms of the little world that I can influence, you know, not just being the parent to two teenage girls, but it's, I think it's like calling things out and reshaping things for them and making them realise that you know, we're not done yet and we still have to continue pushing forward and actually, if we all play a part in that, we'll get to where we want to go quicker.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. On your own you go fast, but together you go far, you do.
Speaker 3:You do. And, interestingly, you know my, my oldest daughter, is 18 in November and and somebody said to her in front of me oh about, you know this boy and you know how bright he was and wasn't going to do well and so on and so forth. And they said to her he's the sort of man you want to marry, amelia, because he's going to be a CEO. And I literally looked at her and I said Amelia, you can be a CEO, you don't need to marry one, you should be one. And she went. I know mum.
Speaker 2:That's what you want, isn't it? And it's crazy that that statement was even made exactly, and it wasn't you know, it was just.
Speaker 3:It was just a flippant comment, meant with just you know, just.
Speaker 2:I guess they were just trying to make a little comment making, yeah, but it was just.
Speaker 3:Like you know, women don't need to marry CEOs anymore. Women are CEOs, whether that's of their own life or whether that's at work, and that's the change that we still need to make.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I think you're right. We always talk about what we can do. There's a big we in the centre of the word power isn't it and? Power right now can be a challenging word and used in challenging ways so. I think we all have that responsibility, isn't it?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think it's like building communities within your own, wherever you can and whatever it might be, that you can share experiences to help someone else. And it could be, as you said, like quite individual, as we're talking about kids, like people who've come back from work. I'm really like quite keen to help if they've, you know, feeling a bit, you know, lost and despondent about having to come back and try and navigate it all. I'm like, well, I've done this three times, it will get better.
Speaker 3:I promise.
Speaker 2:It's more of that, like sharing some of those. Like you know, it might be a really bad day today, but tomorrow will be better.
Speaker 1:It's okay. Communities were made up of so many different parts and. Dna is made up of so many different parts, and we talked about this. I don't know where this is going to take us, but talk to me about how your DNA is made, alex yes, I recently said, you're simple, aren't you, liz? I don't mean that in many ways, yeah, I recently did mine.
Speaker 2:So my um, my mother-in-law, bought me as a birthday present because I've always said my family history is quite mixed and I wanted to know exactly how it was made up. So I did that. So one side of me is very straightforward I'm 49% Cypriot. Okay, cool, you know, you can, maybe you can tell that that makes sense. But the other side of my family is a bit more mixed. So, um, I'm 12% Chinese, which is exciting, which I did know, because my my nan does look Chinese, by the way. But you know, it's to see how it's mixed up, yeah, is like interesting. And then now I found out I'm 12% Indigenous American, like native Indigenous, so like native American. And I didn't know.
Speaker 2:Well, I did know that too, but again, I didn't know how much, because you don't know how much it dilutes as you go through your area and obviously my grandparents would tell me all these different stories and I'm like that can't be true, like it doesn't make sense in your mind. How can you be a bit of this and a bit of that and a bit of this? So yeah, yeah, and has that led you to be more curious? Yeah, because I want to. So I'm really into, like I want to go to China now because it says it's actually the part of the region that she's from. So I want to like understand really specific.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was really specific, like pinpoint exactly where your family from, and even in Cyprus, the specific regions of where my family originated from, and then they all came over um to the UK from Trinidad and it says that that's that's the more recent history, because of their, their movement and stuff, and I'm like, wow, it is quite it's a lot of things to take off the um, the old travel list now and you spent time in Canada, is that right?
Speaker 3:I did, yeah, so I lived in. Uh, I lived in Toronto for three years when, uh, yeah, uh, the girls were well, we moved there with my husband's job and I had three years, I say off, but I was at home looking after toddlers in a, in a country where I knew nobody. So, uh, yeah, um, the little one was six months and the big one was two when we went um, so, three years, um, yeah, toronto housewife, it was absolutely fantastic was it yeah, it's really good what would you say is your superpower?
Speaker 2:oh yeah, I don't know when to bring it back to kids again, but juggling, you have to, I think. If you're not able to do multitask and to juggle some of it, I think that's it's quite big because I'm back in mind. I'm still thinking about the fact that I've got to pay for a school trip that's coming up and. I haven't done it yet. I think compartmentalisation is a really good skill.
Speaker 3:I think.
Speaker 3:Some days I'm better at it than others and, similar to you, you know I feel like I've got everything worked out and you know I'm about to go to a meeting and then I get a text message off one of my kids going can you put money on parent pay? He's got no money for my school dinner. It's like oh um, but I think you know, focusing focusing in different ways on what's important. I think family work, self actually, yeah is also important. I think that's something that we maybe don't think about so much as working parents.
Speaker 1:I was gonna say look into the future, but it's right now.
Speaker 3:AI is everywhere, right, yeah?
Speaker 1:AI and it can be very much pulled up as a bad thing and be pulled up as a you know sort of a positive thing. But how do you think it implements or is impacting on your professional world, but also on your personal world? Does it help?
Speaker 2:you juggle.
Speaker 1:I wish I could figure out a way to make it juggle for me a bit more um.
Speaker 2:I haven't worked out that was any tips more than interested in the personal one, I mean in work.
Speaker 2:It is in recruitment in particular. It is a massive hot topic all the time. So, like within my, within our role in the area that we recruit for, we do recruit for, like AI, engineers and things like that, but then within recruitment, there's so many new tools people want to talk about you know, um, ai, generated CVs and interviews and things like that and it's just a minefield of trying to work out what is going to give you some better results but also not take away from the human aspect of what we do.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean it's hugely. I think it's hugely disruptive. I mentioned I started in the late 90s and it was pretty much with a fax machine, um, you know with that white tape over certain things and, um, I don't even think my kids would know what a fax machine actually is. They look with incredularity at a cd oh, I love an ohp with those squeaky pens um AI, I think in recruitment or talent acquisition is is it's hugely disruptive.
Speaker 3:And I think for me and probably for our team, is certainly the way that we see it at BT is we use it in a way that keeps the people element of the job and just enables us to go faster.
Speaker 3:And I think and I firmly believe you know, recruitment, talent acquisition, whatever you want to call it, ultimately it's sales at the end of the day and sales has a huge people element to it, and it's retaining that people element and using AI to help us extend the amount of time that we have with the people that we work with, to put them into careers at BT or move their career forward whilst they're at BT, because we do internal moves and career changes as well. It's using it in the right way to free your time up to deliver value, which is ultimately, I think, how we use it and final question what is the best bit of advice that you never received?
Speaker 2:Oh, that's hard, I'd say. Say, actually, I'm gonna jump in. I'm gonna say like trust your gut and I think, oh, you know, and what I'm trying to say. Like people say, oh, it's gonna work out in the end, like trust your instinct if you think it's not, and it's more of that, like whatever that might be, wherever that takes you, it's not like trusting you're in the right place or you're not in the right place, or you're not in the right place or you're doing something that's going to make a difference. Or it's not Like trust your gut that, if you are, if you're feeling those warm fuzzy feelings and something is good going on, then that's a good thing.
Speaker 3:go with it, and likewise, if it's not like that, I think, I think, don't dim your ambition, but maybe accept that there is different ways to get there.
Speaker 2:That's wise, isn't?
Speaker 1:it Wise women on this couch today.
Speaker 2:I'm going to change my answer with that.
Speaker 1:No, alex, you can go again for that. You've got a tote bag with that on now. You should Do, you know what, honestly, honestly, I've been.
Speaker 3:I've been asked a few questions about um. You know what, what's the hardest thing in recruitment? And um. The hardest thing in recruitment is and we spoke earlier about you know how nice it is telling people that they've got a job. The worst part is telling people that haven't got a job.
Speaker 3:And then, when you don't give them anything tangible to say and this is what you could do differently it's awful, because you've invested, you've invested your time, they've invested their time and you're not giving them anything back. So, um, I coined a bit of a phrase no, with a bow. And the number of people that are like oh, we're going to trademark that, blah, blah, blah you are known for like the little um.
Speaker 2:I like an analogy yeah, I do like an analogy oh god, I probably should have done that. You know what? There's too many. She comes and I'm like they're not connected. What do you mean and what, what? And then you should explain.
Speaker 3:I'm like, oh yeah, yeah, they're not connected and they're huge and varied um and it probably give you a creepy insight into my mind if I told you, probably, what some of them are. But I think, um, again, something, something through changing the way that we hire, now we have got tangible outcomes to tell everybody about. It might be a no, but it's a not right now and this is what you can do if you want to come back, or this is what you can do to improve, and that, for me, that no with a bow and that way of sort of shaping that engagement with people through that experience is really great. And actually, coming back to your point about what's your best advice, I think it's just try and see things differently.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:And try and imagine things differently, and because it's been done that way for a long time, don't let that limit what you can do and you can influence moving forward.
Speaker 2:I guess it goes back to as well what we were saying before about asking questions. You know if you didn't get what you wanted or you're not getting the feedback or the advice that you need. If you don't ask questions, you'll never really know. You should be sat there with that. I could have done this, I could have done that, and they'll be like actually none of that would have made any difference, because what we wanted is something that you just don't have and you can go. Okay, cool, that makes sense.
Speaker 3:I think positively saying why and positively saying no are two really strong attributes in people.
Speaker 1:They're coming out now, aren't they? They're coming out now.
Speaker 2:This is what I have to do on a daily basis. Sorry about that the wise woman I know.
Speaker 3:But it's true, isn't it Positively saying no, we're not going to do that? And saying, but why? Why do we do it that way? And I think that's how we arrived at this different way of hiring now, which is so much better, challenging the curiosity, because if you keep doing things the way they are, we'll keep getting the same Amazing.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much for joining us on the Teal Couch. Thank you for having us so much top tips and advice. It doesn't matter whether you're new into a role or you're coming back into work or you're you know you are thinking I'm just not sure. It's okay. It's okay, but ask the questions, do your research, yeah, and be ready with that real, super curious question as well.
Speaker 3:And enjoy who you meet along the way. Oh, real, super curious question as well. Yeah, and enjoy who you meet along the way.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, it's all experience. At the end of the day, even if it doesn't work out, it's all experience for the next one. It is yeah. Thank you so much.
Speaker 1:Alex.
Speaker 3:Thank you. Thank you so much.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much to the BT Massive for joining us today. Thank you so much for being amazing partners and always, always, mega supportive. So thank you so much for joining us on the we Are Power podcast. Subscribe on YouTube, Apple, Amazon Music, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. Leave us a review or follow us on socials. We are power underscore net on Insta, TikTok and Twitter. We are power on LinkedIn, Facebook and we are underscore power on YouTube.
